We hate the kiosks at McDonald’s, Wendy’s, and Taco Bell that we are asked to use instead of talking to a person
Personally I love the kiosks. I love being able to select exactly what I want, and not go through a communication layer with a person, who may mishear or misinterpret what I say, and adding that while still having humans there for people who don’t like using screens or actually have questions is a good thing IMO.
But yes, AI is all the flaws of human workers, plus some because they always have and always will be significantly worse than humans at spotting mistakes giving you what you don’t want etc…
I hate the kiosks BECAUSE they removed a key feature that the POS can do: substitution at no cost. If you order a McGriddle, sausage egg and cheese, at the POS, you say “substitute” whole egg (the white and yolk instead of the folded egg), and it’s the same price. At the kiosk, at least 4 years ago when I last used one, when you want to do this, you need to add the whole egg for a cost, then remove the folded egg at no credit.
At chick fil a, when you remove ingredients on a sandwich, that amount actually gets removed from the cost of the sandwich. Fuck chick fil a’s profit spending, but their ordering system is the best for customers.
Personally I’d rather they keep the same number of employees and just work less hard. Fast food workers seem to have way too much to do for their pay scale. They should take the pay from the absurdly overpaid upper management, though.
Sorry, the best they can do is triple prices because they want to give the appearance of being “premium”.
Oh and those kiosks I’m sure are provided by a company run by someone on the Board, and cost multiple thousands for something that could be done with a $500 touchscreen and a Raspberry Pi.
And software run by yet another provider on the Board that has a dev team comprised of everyone’s nephew trying to use AI to vibe code it.
That kiosk exists to push specific parts of the menu toward you, while minimizing your interaction with loss leaders, and if linked to your rewards account, collect and use all of your spending habit data. It’s a consumer manipulation tactic that is meant to seem convenient, while providing an excuse for the company to hire less workers/pay workers less.
Source: Am fastfood worker at a company that refuses to do this.
Jokes on them, I always get the same order. Can’t ish something in me if I’m already done before I get started. That said, I’ve had MDs once in two years, and it was because it was almost 2am in the middle of bfn.
I don’t really eat at fast food places with kiosks, but when I have had the occasion I actually prefer it too. Because I don’t eat at these places often I am generally unfamiliar with the menu and the kiosk tends to have it organized with pictures which are helpful if I don’t know what a “crazy burger” is. It also makes me feel less rushed since I don’t have a human on the other end who has to wait for me to decide or to tell me what’s in a crazy burger or whatever. Especially because a lot of places don’t seem to display their full menu anymore. Not sure what’s up with that.
Like anything these days I suspect it’s a profit maximisation thing. They push the stuff that makes them the most money, and since people don’t usually keep the full menu in their head if they can’t remember it they can’t order it.
I only don’t like the in-store kiosk because it doesn’t have the same customizability options that are on the mobile app, so I end up having to talk to a person anyway when I want certain things, like the scrambled egg mcmuffin or tomato on a QPC.
Why would you ever use the kiosk when you can use the mobile app?
It’s just a shitty version of the same thing with zero privacy and completely filthy with other people’s kids’ nastiness all over it. Don’t get me wrong, all of our phones are disgusting but it only takes a few minutes of being in earshot of a public bathroom to realize how few people actually wash their hands after they shit all over the stall, floor, doors, walls and selves.
or just use the drive through and pay with cash and avoid all of this
I get that they keep trying to eliminate humans that take drive through orders, but there will always be an escalation path for a real human. Just takes a single car blocking the lane lol.
I mean the problem with drive throughs is that’s like the most painful way to order anything. Doesn’t matter if it’s a human or an AI. Lets talk on a garbage speaker 6 feet away with traffic, wind and everything else inbetween. Without being able to see the face of the person. Know when or if the feed has been cut off, also the added fun of the speed being terrible and of course the ability to get stuck because even if you realize it’s not worth the time… a car can pull up behind you and force you to wait it out as long as it takes.
Drive through would require I get a car tho, I was more trying to defend the kiosks as, while I understand that they aren’t perfect for various reasons, like dark patterns and such that software ordering enables, I genuinely find that kiosk format the least stressful way to order food, in the rare instance that I’m at a place that has them. Dont have to install their app, doesn’t activate my social anxiety like asking an actual person for things, and I can walk in and use it rather than needing a vehicle.
The kiosk doesn’t collect data about me, afaik. I don’t have to log in to it. And it’s not like I care if someone sees what I order. They’re gonna be able to see me eat it, too, since if I am in the store I am usually gonna eat in the store.
Was thinking more about the looking over your shoulder aspect.
You use a credit card right? probably one with the same number you use in other places with your name and address attached right? They know what you buy man. Odds are some commercial source has every possible detail about your life attached to it like your wage history, purchasing history, web viewing/commenting history…
Maybe if you used pre-paid gift gift cards or something you could be somewhat anonymous, but nowadays with how cheap and easy facial recognition tech, walking gait tech and license plate reader tech is… doubt that will work for long.
Edit: Mcdonalds is using cameras to verify the accuracy of orders before they are handed to customers. Do you REALLY think they aren’t going to go a step further and record license plates, faces and gait? Verkada, a commercial brand of cameras I manage, already does this publicly for plates and faces. Gait is not new and as unique as a fingerprint. Nobody is going to admit they are tracking your biomechanics, even if they do it every single day.
AI/ML gets shit wrong and sure, maybe in rare instances you’ll be mistaken for someone else… but they’re going hard into surveillance tech. They already have surveillance promotions where different people get different promotions at the same store for the exact same products.
But it’s not like you or anyone here can show the damage to privacy or otherwise a fast food app is going to have versus the very real conveniences others have brought up here.
But it’s not like you or anyone here can show the damage to privacy or otherwise a fast food app is going to have versus the very real conveniences others have brought up here.
The information we have obtained includes the following:
Identifiers such as name, postal and email addresses, internet protocol (IP) address, social media handles, username, password, and other contact information used to register and access McDonald’s products and services, log-in to Wi-Fi, enter one of our competitions, or contact us by phone or through our online services. The following categories of personal information described in California Civil Code § 1798.80(e):
the personal information listed in the preceding bullet point as “identifiers;”
signatures;
telephone number;
payment information (including payment card details or online payment services number and invoicing address) and financial information (such as bank account numbers);
physical characteristics or description; and
the other information that identifies, relates to, describes, oris capable of being associated with, a particular individual that we describe in “Information We Collect & Process.”
Commercial information, including:
records of products or services purchased or received from McDonald’s;
username, password, or other account information used to obtain access to McDonald’s online services;
information on actions taken on McDonald’s online services, which may include information about McDonald’s products or services considered and the times you visit our online services; and
information about consumer preferences and behavior that we collect on our online services or purchase from third parties in order to target consumers for digital advertisements or to personalize content we deliver on our online services.
Internet or other electronic network activity information, including, but not limited to, browsing history, search history, and information regarding a consumer’s interaction with an Internet Web site, application, or advertisement, as well as the information listed above in the section titled “Information We Collect & Process:”
computer or mobile-device operating system and browser type;
type of mobile device and its settings;
unique device identifier (UDID) or mobile equipment identifier (MEID) for your mobile device;
device and component serial numbers;
advertising identifiers (for example, IDFAs and IFAs) or similar identifiers;
referring website (a site that has led you to ours) or application;
online activity on other websites, applications, or social media; and
activity related to how you use our online services, such as the pages you visit on our online services.
Geolocation data.
Characteristics of protected classifications under California or federal law, such as demographic information like age or gender.
Audio information from calls placed with customer service centers which may be recorded, and electronic information in the form of Internet or other electronic network activity information as described above. When you visit our restaurants, we may capture audio and video information inside and outside our restaurants via CCTV cameras and other tools that help us monitor restaurant safety and improve our operations.
Inferences drawn from:
the information we collect when you visit our websites, use our apps, interact with our official social media pages, or otherwise interact with us;
information we collect, including through third-party suppliers, regarding content and other data posted on the Internet (such as public locations on the Internet); and
information about consumer preferences and behavior that we collect on our online services or purchase from third parties in order to create a profile about a consumer reflecting the consumer’s preferences, characteristics, psychological trends, predispositions, behavior, attitudes, intelligence, abilities, or aptitudes.
Sensitive personal information, such as account login credentials when combined with passwords, and precise geolocation data, as described above. If you win a competition, contest, prize draw, or sweepstakes, we may also collect your social security number and driver’s license or state identification card as part of legal compliance.
Damage? Where’s the damage? I’m just not sure that giving up practical conviences for whatever this reads like to you and has you worried about is worth it. You’d use no apps ever. And you’d have to consistently be going with less as the technology moves on and you boycott it all. They are literally not staffing these places the way they used to.
I just prefer self checkout. The less time I have to talk to someone the better. My dollar tree got rid of it and I was sad. 6 checkouts became 1 cashier.
I just prefer doing it myself, since many times I go at the same time and end up chatting with the self checkout lady. I just prefer to bag the stuff myself.
you’re going through the same communication layer, you’re just shutting your brain off and tap tap tap… it’s making you stupider, while you order your fat food…
the stupid customer does the job stuff is horrid. anyone that actually uses and promotes it must be half brain-dead… AI will make sure you’re fully brain dead
I’m meaning picking the items and what I want on my food. Point is when I hit “extra pickles” the computer doesn’t go “no pickles?” or possibly ignore me. Point is voice communication is… well rife with mishearing and miscommunication, whether the recipient is an AI or a human.
Just as when I’m communicating with humans… if not having mistakes is important, I send a text.
The only complaint I disagree with is
We hate the kiosks at McDonald’s, Wendy’s, and Taco Bell that we are asked to use instead of talking to a person
Personally I love the kiosks. I love being able to select exactly what I want, and not go through a communication layer with a person, who may mishear or misinterpret what I say, and adding that while still having humans there for people who don’t like using screens or actually have questions is a good thing IMO.
But yes, AI is all the flaws of human workers, plus some because they always have and always will be significantly worse than humans at spotting mistakes giving you what you don’t want etc…
I hate the kiosks BECAUSE they removed a key feature that the POS can do: substitution at no cost. If you order a McGriddle, sausage egg and cheese, at the POS, you say “substitute” whole egg (the white and yolk instead of the folded egg), and it’s the same price. At the kiosk, at least 4 years ago when I last used one, when you want to do this, you need to add the whole egg for a cost, then remove the folded egg at no credit.
At chick fil a, when you remove ingredients on a sandwich, that amount actually gets removed from the cost of the sandwich. Fuck chick fil a’s profit spending, but their ordering system is the best for customers.
I prefer the kiosks too, but if they’re going to be hiring fewer people as a result, prices should be reduced to account for their cost savings.
Personally I’d rather they keep the same number of employees and just work less hard. Fast food workers seem to have way too much to do for their pay scale. They should take the pay from the absurdly overpaid upper management, though.
But if they do that, how can they maximize shareholder value?
‘Shareholder Value’ is derived from Rents. It’s McDonalds.
Sorry, the best they can do is triple prices because they want to give the appearance of being “premium”.
Oh and those kiosks I’m sure are provided by a company run by someone on the Board, and cost multiple thousands for something that could be done with a $500 touchscreen and a Raspberry Pi.
And software run by yet another provider on the Board that has a dev team comprised of everyone’s nephew trying to use AI to vibe code it.
“Cronyism and self-dealing in my laissez-faire capitalism?”
It’s more likely than you think.
Oh…oh you must be new here. And by “here” I mean Earth.
HA you’re going to pay MORE and have to do more work. slave…
Yeah, the kiosk means I can browse the whole menu, and take my time deciding what I want. Definitely the better option.
You always could browse a menu and take all the time you wanted.
The kiosks are for trying to guide you to less choices if possible, and then upsell.
I hate the damn things. Fortunately I dont eat fast food so it doesnt affect me.
A lot of fast food places don’t have every single combo displayed on the menu boards.
That would be pretty surprising to me. They almost always at least say you can combine to a meal.
Although you are proving my point: combos make them money, they want to sell you more. Thats why you see them.
That kiosk exists to push specific parts of the menu toward you, while minimizing your interaction with loss leaders, and if linked to your rewards account, collect and use all of your spending habit data. It’s a consumer manipulation tactic that is meant to seem convenient, while providing an excuse for the company to hire less workers/pay workers less.
Source: Am fastfood worker at a company that refuses to do this.
Jokes on them, I always get the same order. Can’t ish something in me if I’m already done before I get started. That said, I’ve had MDs once in two years, and it was because it was almost 2am in the middle of bfn.
Do you think we go to fast food places and peruse the menu and drink list?
It doesn’t matter. What I’m saying is you used to have that choice.
I don’t really eat at fast food places with kiosks, but when I have had the occasion I actually prefer it too. Because I don’t eat at these places often I am generally unfamiliar with the menu and the kiosk tends to have it organized with pictures which are helpful if I don’t know what a “crazy burger” is. It also makes me feel less rushed since I don’t have a human on the other end who has to wait for me to decide or to tell me what’s in a crazy burger or whatever. Especially because a lot of places don’t seem to display their full menu anymore. Not sure what’s up with that.
Like anything these days I suspect it’s a profit maximisation thing. They push the stuff that makes them the most money, and since people don’t usually keep the full menu in their head if they can’t remember it they can’t order it.
I only don’t like the in-store kiosk because it doesn’t have the same customizability options that are on the mobile app, so I end up having to talk to a person anyway when I want certain things, like the scrambled egg mcmuffin or tomato on a QPC.
Why would you ever use the kiosk when you can use the mobile app?
It’s just a shitty version of the same thing with zero privacy and completely filthy with other people’s kids’ nastiness all over it. Don’t get me wrong, all of our phones are disgusting but it only takes a few minutes of being in earshot of a public bathroom to realize how few people actually wash their hands after they shit all over the stall, floor, doors, walls and selves.
In the rare instance that I go to mcdonalds, Id rather use their device than put their app on my device, or make an account to use such an app.
or just use the drive through and pay with cash and avoid all of this
I get that they keep trying to eliminate humans that take drive through orders, but there will always be an escalation path for a real human. Just takes a single car blocking the lane lol.
I mean the problem with drive throughs is that’s like the most painful way to order anything. Doesn’t matter if it’s a human or an AI. Lets talk on a garbage speaker 6 feet away with traffic, wind and everything else inbetween. Without being able to see the face of the person. Know when or if the feed has been cut off, also the added fun of the speed being terrible and of course the ability to get stuck because even if you realize it’s not worth the time… a car can pull up behind you and force you to wait it out as long as it takes.
Drive through would require I get a car tho, I was more trying to defend the kiosks as, while I understand that they aren’t perfect for various reasons, like dark patterns and such that software ordering enables, I genuinely find that kiosk format the least stressful way to order food, in the rare instance that I’m at a place that has them. Dont have to install their app, doesn’t activate my social anxiety like asking an actual person for things, and I can walk in and use it rather than needing a vehicle.
The kiosk doesn’t collect data about me, afaik. I don’t have to log in to it. And it’s not like I care if someone sees what I order. They’re gonna be able to see me eat it, too, since if I am in the store I am usually gonna eat in the store.
Was thinking more about the looking over your shoulder aspect.
You use a credit card right? probably one with the same number you use in other places with your name and address attached right? They know what you buy man. Odds are some commercial source has every possible detail about your life attached to it like your wage history, purchasing history, web viewing/commenting history…
Maybe if you used pre-paid gift gift cards or something you could be somewhat anonymous, but nowadays with how cheap and easy facial recognition tech, walking gait tech and license plate reader tech is… doubt that will work for long.
Edit: Mcdonalds is using cameras to verify the accuracy of orders before they are handed to customers. Do you REALLY think they aren’t going to go a step further and record license plates, faces and gait? Verkada, a commercial brand of cameras I manage, already does this publicly for plates and faces. Gait is not new and as unique as a fingerprint. Nobody is going to admit they are tracking your biomechanics, even if they do it every single day.
AI/ML gets shit wrong and sure, maybe in rare instances you’ll be mistaken for someone else… but they’re going hard into surveillance tech. They already have surveillance promotions where different people get different promotions at the same store for the exact same products.
This is a crazy amount of paranoia, especially from someone who is instead recommending a fucking app.
But it’s not like you or anyone here can show the damage to privacy or otherwise a fast food app is going to have versus the very real conveniences others have brought up here.
McDonald’s privacy page:
The information we have obtained includes the following: Identifiers such as name, postal and email addresses, internet protocol (IP) address, social media handles, username, password, and other contact information used to register and access McDonald’s products and services, log-in to Wi-Fi, enter one of our competitions, or contact us by phone or through our online services. The following categories of personal information described in California Civil Code § 1798.80(e): the personal information listed in the preceding bullet point as “identifiers;” signatures; telephone number; payment information (including payment card details or online payment services number and invoicing address) and financial information (such as bank account numbers); physical characteristics or description; and the other information that identifies, relates to, describes, or is capable of being associated with, a particular individual that we describe in “Information We Collect & Process.” Commercial information, including: records of products or services purchased or received from McDonald’s; username, password, or other account information used to obtain access to McDonald’s online services; information on actions taken on McDonald’s online services, which may include information about McDonald’s products or services considered and the times you visit our online services; and information about consumer preferences and behavior that we collect on our online services or purchase from third parties in order to target consumers for digital advertisements or to personalize content we deliver on our online services. Internet or other electronic network activity information, including, but not limited to, browsing history, search history, and information regarding a consumer’s interaction with an Internet Web site, application, or advertisement, as well as the information listed above in the section titled “Information We Collect & Process:” computer or mobile-device operating system and browser type; type of mobile device and its settings; unique device identifier (UDID) or mobile equipment identifier (MEID) for your mobile device; device and component serial numbers; advertising identifiers (for example, IDFAs and IFAs) or similar identifiers; referring website (a site that has led you to ours) or application; online activity on other websites, applications, or social media; and activity related to how you use our online services, such as the pages you visit on our online services. Geolocation data. Characteristics of protected classifications under California or federal law, such as demographic information like age or gender. Audio information from calls placed with customer service centers which may be recorded, and electronic information in the form of Internet or other electronic network activity information as described above. When you visit our restaurants, we may capture audio and video information inside and outside our restaurants via CCTV cameras and other tools that help us monitor restaurant safety and improve our operations. Inferences drawn from: the information we collect when you visit our websites, use our apps, interact with our official social media pages, or otherwise interact with us; information we collect, including through third-party suppliers, regarding content and other data posted on the Internet (such as public locations on the Internet); and information about consumer preferences and behavior that we collect on our online services or purchase from third parties in order to create a profile about a consumer reflecting the consumer’s preferences, characteristics, psychological trends, predispositions, behavior, attitudes, intelligence, abilities, or aptitudes. Sensitive personal information, such as account login credentials when combined with passwords, and precise geolocation data, as described above. If you win a competition, contest, prize draw, or sweepstakes, we may also collect your social security number and driver’s license or state identification card as part of legal compliance.Damage? Where’s the damage? I’m just not sure that giving up practical conviences for whatever this reads like to you and has you worried about is worth it. You’d use no apps ever. And you’d have to consistently be going with less as the technology moves on and you boycott it all. They are literally not staffing these places the way they used to.
Yeah, just gimme the NP6 terminal, I’ll figure it out.
I just prefer self checkout. The less time I have to talk to someone the better. My dollar tree got rid of it and I was sad. 6 checkouts became 1 cashier.
I just prefer doing it myself, since many times I go at the same time and end up chatting with the self checkout lady. I just prefer to bag the stuff myself.
you’re going through the same communication layer, you’re just shutting your brain off and tap tap tap… it’s making you stupider, while you order your fat food…
the stupid customer does the job stuff is horrid. anyone that actually uses and promotes it must be half brain-dead… AI will make sure you’re fully brain dead
I’m meaning picking the items and what I want on my food. Point is when I hit “extra pickles” the computer doesn’t go “no pickles?” or possibly ignore me. Point is voice communication is… well rife with mishearing and miscommunication, whether the recipient is an AI or a human.
Just as when I’m communicating with humans… if not having mistakes is important, I send a text.